Podcasting Tips! From Sarah Heeter

[00:00:00] AI isn't going to be able to identify your best search terms. 

[00:00:05] And I think really capitalizing on, especially those first few words of your episode title. Make it really searchable.

[00:00:10] What would they want to know? And then use their exact question as the episode title. 

[00:00:15] This sounds terrible, but almost like clickbait episode titles. And so if you can think of it in those terms. 

[00:00:20] You don't have to summarize the whole episode. Or what was the overall theme? It doesn't matter. 

[00:00:24] You just have to get what is that searchable term? That is going to be discussed in the episode at some point? 

[00:00:29] Welcome to the third season of the Simple and Smart SEO Show, the podcast dedicated to empathy driven, brand building SEO. I'm your host, Crystal Waddell. I leverage my obsession with user experience to help business owners just like you optimize your website with confidence. 

[00:00:45] Thank you so much for being here.

[00:00:46] Let's jump into another great episode. 

Introducing Podcast Expert Sarah K Heeter

[00:00:48] 

[00:00:48] Hey guys, welcome back to the Simple and Smart SEO Show Podcast. I'm here with podcast expert, Sarah K Heeter from Podfox Media.

[00:00:58] Sarah is the CEO and founder of Podfox. 

[00:01:01] And she is a podcast producer and strategic consultant. So thank you so much, Sarah K Heeter for being here. 

[00:01:09] How are you? 

[00:01:10] Oh, thank you for having me. I'm I'm, this is surreal for me because we were chatting about this before, but I listen to your podcast very regularly.

[00:01:18] So it's so fun to be a guest on a show you actually listen to. 

[00:01:20] Yeah, that's crazy. And it's, that's so true because the last podcast I recorded about two hours ago. I listen to! 

[00:01:27] Yeah, it's the SEO Rant Podcast. 

Exploring the Evolution of Podcasting

[00:01:29] So how long have you been podcasting and been 

[00:01:31] involved with podcasting? 

[00:01:33] Yeah, I've been involved with podcasting since 2016, which I think makes me like honorary old school, but honestly, podcasting has been around for two decades, so it's really not. 

[00:01:42] But I officially started my actual business full time all in, in 2019. 

[00:01:48] And back then it was just me and I didn't have a business name. I couldn't come up with one. I'm sure a lot of people listening can relate to that. 

[00:01:54] So I just did business under the name I already have. And then as it grew and I added team members, it amanda at Sarah k Heeter. com. 

[00:02:02] So that's where it really started. The pressure started for, okay, we need a business name. So in 2022, we actually came up with pod Fox media and developed all the branding and everything like that. And yeah, now we have a pretty small, but mighty team behind pod Fox media.

[00:02:16] And it's different. It's reframing to building. Like a company instead of being a service provider and just trying to just one on one client relationships, if that makes sense. So it's been an interesting pivot and of evolution. Yeah, 

[00:02:28] It is interesting. I'm curious. So what are you an agency then? Do you, for people or what? How do people work with you? 

Strategies for Podcast Growth and Audience Engagement

[00:02:36] So our primary, like how we really built momentum is through yes, full service podcast production. And strategic consultation. 

[00:02:44] So it includes not just like the editing and production and hosting side, but also it's helping people with. What content is going to serve them. How to optimize their podcasts, how to leverage their podcasts to actually build the rest of their business.

[00:02:58] So we say we help people strategically launch, grow, and monetize podcasts in order to expand their audience, establish their expertise and find more ways to make money online. 

[00:03:08] And. Then, in addition to that, because a huge like component of our brand is that we really want to help more. 

[00:03:16] Especially underrepresented voices get past episode 11. 50 percent of people who podcast quit before episode 11.

[00:03:22] So if we can help more underrepresented voices, either in their industries, communities, or podcasting in general, get past episode 11, then we're doing something good for the world. 

[00:03:30] In order to do that, we have expanded to two additional offers. One is for like DIYers or people who are working with other kind of managers or editors who just want a strategic consultation session.

[00:03:40] You can just pay by the hour for that. 

[00:03:42] And then we also have like a digital resource membership that includes one live monthly training, that's like topical. 

[00:03:49] So we've done AI, sponsorship social media for podcasters, how to host a great interview. And so on and so forth. 

[00:03:54] And then also one live call a month, that's a coaching call Q and a, and then it's the entire digital resource library as well.

[00:04:01] So all the replays and any of the like self paced workbooks. And so we try to have that available at just the lowest price point possible so that it's accessible to all people who want a podcast. 

[00:04:10] Yeah that's super cool. 

[00:04:12] Some of the people I've talked to, they have said that public relations is so important in 2024. 

[00:04:18] And the last person I talked to actually said that podcasting was the best form of public relations in 2024.

The Importance of Guest Strategy in Podcasting

[00:04:26] And going on podcasts. Can you give us any tips being a guest or having a guest strategy? 

[00:04:31] Yeah, I would definitely say it's the easiest and lowest barrier to entry, right? I think PR and media relations in general is this almost like SEO.

[00:04:38] It's confusing and it's like, how do you even get PR for yourself? 

[00:04:42] Unless you hire somebody who is like a PR person. But yeah, I think podcasting is just people. So it's a really low barrier to entry, which is good. I think the biggest tips that I can give, and we were talking about this at the beginning, but.

[00:04:54] Think about it as actually trying to build a relationship with somebody you actually want to build a relationship with. 

[00:04:59] And really focusing on shows that are hosted by people and for communities that you genuinely can come in and add value. 

[00:05:07] I like to say that it's like you're a guest in someone else's house.

[00:05:11] And why would somebody bring you into their house to sell something to their family, basically? So are you going to be a door to door knives salesman? 

[00:05:20] Or are you going to actually build a relationship and, have game nights? And enjoy each other's families in your home. For family dinners, right?

[00:05:27] That totally reminds me of like why we started this podcast. 

[00:05:30] It's still true now. We wanted people to be able to be a fly on the wall of the conversations that we are having.

[00:05:35] It's so helpful and it sparks ideas for people. 

[00:05:38] When they hear someone else talk about their business and then it's Oh wait, I can do that too. 

[00:05:41] And yeah, I love that because I feel like. All of our friends are in the room, listening and nodding and, putting their own twist on what they hear.

[00:05:48] Exactly. 

[00:05:49] And I just think so often we think of going on other people's podcasts as going on our own press tour. like, 

[00:05:54] Oh, I have a book coming out. So I'm going to get on as many podcasts I can to promote the same interview. 

[00:06:00] Giving the same answers. Having the same conversation.

[00:06:02] Speaking of the SEO point. 

[00:06:03] If people love that conversation and then they search for you because they want to hear as much as they can from you. 

[00:06:07] They're hearing you have the same exact canned conversation everywhere. First of all, and second of all, what is the incentive?

[00:06:12] Like you work so hard to cultivate this audience and to build your own kind of brand identity for yourself. And. Why would you just have someone else come in and dilute that? 

[00:06:21] So that they can promote their book? It has to be a mutual relationship. 

[00:06:26] And I think, thinking of it as, is this a person I would want to continue to collaborate with?

[00:06:29] Is this a person I want to have an ongoing relationship with? What else could we do together? 

[00:06:33] And if we joined forces, what could we accomplish? And then approaching it from that angle. And I think you're going to have a lot more success. 

[00:06:39] So as far as like, tips for doing it, that's probably where I'd start.

[00:06:43] Yeah. 

[00:06:44] That's so cool. I think it might be a little bit helpful to think of it like a press tour. 

[00:06:48] We do want people to be aware of us. 

[00:06:49] But I totally agree with you. 

[00:06:51] Why have this particular conversation if I've already heard it? 

[00:06:54] When you have your own podcast, Like, how can you make it so that people can find it?

Maximizing Podcast Searchability and Episode Titles

[00:06:59] Do you have any searchability tips on that? 

[00:07:02] Yeah, I know that you have definitely had other great episodes about podcasting before. 

[00:07:07] And so some of this is just echoing the same things that you have already shared. 

[00:07:11] But I think clear over cute is something that we talk about a lot. And I think the biggest kind of missed opportunity area that I see is with your episode titles. 

[00:07:21] I think so many people, especially with leveraging AI, which I am a huge AI lover. 

[00:07:26] I mentioned earlier, we did a whole training already and we'll definitely do more about leveraging AI for your podcast. 

[00:07:32] But I think AI isn't going to be able to identify your best search terms.

[00:07:38] And a lot of times I see people are using like these really corny, cheesy episode titles. And I think really capitalizing on, especially those first few words of your episode title, make it really searchable.

[00:07:49] So one of the podcasts that I host is actually for Girl Scout troop leaders in the U S. 

[00:07:54] And I have had this really great success with asking my audience in my Facebook group for listeners. If they could go to coffee with me and they could pick my brain about anything related to running a Girl Scout troop.

[00:08:07] What would they want to know? And then I use their exact question as the episode title. 

[00:08:12] And I've had people express to me like when that episode popped up as available in my Library on my favorite podcast listening app. I literally stopped what I was listening to so I could go hear it. 

[00:08:20] So you want almost like. This sounds terrible, but almost like clickbait episode titles. And so if you can think of it in those terms, if that's easier than knowing what would be a good, I don't know how to summarize, you don't have to summarize the episode. It doesn't matter. 

[00:08:32] You don't have to summarize the whole episode or what was the overall theme?

[00:08:35] You just have to get what is that searchable term that is going to be discussed in the episode at some point? 

[00:08:41] That is so comforting, because I always try to find like a keyword. That matches, or aligns with whatever we're talking about in the podcast. 

[00:08:48] But I do feel like I have to provide some sort of summary as the title.

[00:08:52] And so that's a, that's like a, like paradigm shift for me. 

[00:08:56] Permission slip to take that pressure off yourself. 

[00:08:59] Especially because These are so much more just organic conversations. We're talking about a topic, but we're just letting it flow wherever it goes. So then the pressure of trying to come up with a searchable term that captures what we talked about is like trying to reverse engineer what was organic.

[00:09:12] And it's no, take that pressure off of yourself. And just put something that you did talk about that, people really want to hear. 

[00:09:18] That is awesome. I love that. 

[00:09:20] So we've talked a little bit before on the show about having an audio strategy . 

Why Audio Content is Essential in Marketing Strategies

[00:09:24] But it still seems a little bit like outside the norm of marketing. So why do you say that audio content needs to be a part of our marketing strategy? 

[00:09:33] Yeah it's funny because I know like nobody even has the app anymore on their phones or there are a lot of users. 

[00:09:38] But clubhouse came out in 2020, right?

[00:09:40] Because we were seeking this intimate connection. 

[00:09:43] And if you remember how it felt to be on clubhouse, when it first came out, if you were on it. 

[00:09:47] That connection that you get from audio only content. Is intimate is the best word I can use to describe it. 

[00:09:53] So podcasting actually mimics the intimacy of a phone call. 

[00:09:57] Which is what gives it a unique leverage opportunity over something like video or images or text posts.

[00:10:03] So all of those are important too, for lots of different reasons. But the same way everyone's promoting video, show your face. 

[00:10:09] Now by 2024. Audio only content is something that you can't just ignore anymore. Because the opportunity to create that level of connection with your listeners is just so critical for moving forward as everybody, the world has opened back up again.

[00:10:25] Everybody's on the go. People are going back into the office, which is so crazy. I like four years later, all of a sudden there's more and more people being called back in. 

[00:10:34] And. In person events have ramped up completely back to old ways, traveling is so busy. 

[00:10:41] So I remember clubhouse. Clubhouse was where I found my voice.

[00:10:45] And my confidence. And what I know. 

[00:10:47] Yeah, it was because, there was all these rooms and I could talk about different things. I love sports and I could talk about my experience as an athlete. 

[00:10:54] And I sell senior night gifts. And so I was like, doing some user research at the same time. 

[00:10:59] And then I love Pinterest.

[00:11:01] So I was talking about Pinterest. And then I found out that, oh, my gosh. 

[00:11:04] I have like strategies and ways of doing things that other people don't know about. And I thought, Oh, everybody must be doing this. 

[00:11:12] And that's when I realized I was like, I actually could, teach other people this. 

[00:11:15] Or, like I could be a leader.

[00:11:17] So that was really powerful. I love clubhouse. I think I still have a room there. If there are rooms. 

[00:11:21] It changed so much.

[00:11:23] But I just want to encourage you: if you are struggling to find your message, audio really helps.

[00:11:28] I really love that perspective. And I would just say too, it's on, so it's on both sides. Like that value that you just said, which I. I'm totally going to mention in the future. 

[00:11:37] That benefit for you, but then also the benefit for the listener, because if they're on the go, they're multitasking.

The Power of Audio Content in Everyday Life

[00:11:43] Yeah. You can play a YouTube video, while you're multitasking. But then you're missing the whole video component, right?

[00:11:49] And it's not meant for being interrupted. It's not meant for multitasking. And audio only content is. 

[00:11:54] You can Listen to podcasts while you're in the school pickup and drop off line or commuting to and from an office or even downloading episodes and then sitting on a plane for five hours to cross the country. 

[00:12:04] Whatever it is, washing the dishes, exercising. There are so many opportunities to stay connected with people where they are through audio only content.

[00:12:11] So it's both sides. I really love that. 

[00:12:13] Okay, so let's think 

How Businesses Can Leverage Audio Content

[00:12:14] about maybe a business that is like a local florist shop. 

[00:12:18] Or, an automotive repair shop. How could a business like that use audio? 

[00:12:23] Totally throwing you a curve ball.

[00:12:24] Didn't tell you, I was gonna ask you something like that. 

Strategic Approach to Launching Audio Content

[00:12:26] Just 

[00:12:26] the approach that I use when I'm talking with somebody about launch strategy. Like I'm thinking of this and what do I do? Is that if you're thinking about just a traditional podcast, right?

[00:12:34] Then there's three pieces that you really need to be clear on one. And I'm, I can do, I actually have a whole 90 minute strategy session I offer on this. So I'm just going to 90 second it. Okay. But the the first piece is who's listening. So you need to be really clear on who your target audience is.

[00:12:47] So in a case like that, like a florist or like a On auto mechanic. Is that what you said? 

[00:12:52] My dad was an auto mechanic. So that popped into my head. 

[00:12:55] My dad was a car salesman. They could have worked together. 

[00:12:57] Normally, in their marketing endeavors, they're trying to reach perspective clients.

[00:13:01] Who are perspective customers, right? Who might be able to purchase their products or services in the future. 

[00:13:06] So, like a car mechanic could speak to maybe some basic things to know about your car. 

[00:13:12] And what is actually going on with your car, but also speaking to how do you know where to take your car and how do you trust the person on the other end?

[00:13:19] There's a lot of. Like lack of trust in that industry in particular. 

[00:13:22] Like knowing who's listening, you can know then what it is that they need to hear from you to build that kind of loyalty. 

[00:13:28] But then there's also opportunities for, you could specifically speak to things about mechanics and things about repairs.

[00:13:36] And then you're actually catering to people working or franchising your operation, or you're looking to start coaching people on how to open their own mechanic shops and run their own mechanic shops locally.

[00:13:47] Like you have to know who are you talking to and don't try to talk to everybody. It's not going to feel like a phone call then. 

[00:13:52] So then the second piece of it that you really need is to know what you want them to get out of it. So you know who's listening. 

[00:13:57] What are you hoping to accomplish if they listen to your show consistently for again, this is talking traditional podcasting for a year, five years.

[00:14:04] What is the overall promise or goal that you're trying to help them accomplish with your podcast? And then the third piece is what do you hope to get from it? And so that kind of comes back to what I was saying. Are you trying to get more customers to walk in your door? Are you trying to stay in touch with people who have purchased from you before and really build that connection?

[00:14:18] So they're going to continue to come back to you and refer people to you. Are you trying to bring people in that you want to eventually hire? Are you going to coach? What are you trying to accomplish? So you have to have goals for yourself as well. That was more than 90 seconds. Sorry. 

Building Trust and Connection Through Podcasting

[00:14:30] I'm thinking it was Kim Tradewell, that was on the show that talked about using audio content. 

[00:14:34] I think she came on last year. And in SEO, there's this thing called EAT, E-E-A-T. 

[00:14:39] . 

[00:14:39] But essentially it's like your expertise, your experience, your authority and trust.

[00:14:46] The idea of doing that. And finding a way to communicate those things to a client through a website. 

[00:14:52] It's similar to that of, podcast. Because like when people come to your website, what do you want them to see? That you want them to see your face, right?

[00:14:59] That you want to be your workspace. If they are going to come in. Because then they know what to expect. 

[00:15:05] And so that, that creates trust. 

[00:15:07] And a lot of times trust can mean a lot of different things, but in business, I think it. It really starts with give me an expectation and then meet that expectation.

[00:15:17] And then if that happens, trust you. And so again, with the audio I don't know if you felt like this, but because, you've listened to the podcast or I've listened to other podcasts, when you talk to that person, it feels like you already know them. 

[00:15:29] Totally. Yes. 

[00:15:30] And that's trust, and those are things that you can't.

[00:15:33] Just, have spontaneously. And it's hard to know everybody before you actually meet. 

[00:15:38] But that's one advantage that I've seen of having this podcast. 

[00:15:41] Is it's just easy to jump into conversation with people who have listened because it's like, we're just continuing what we talked about before.

[00:15:48] Totally. I feel that because part of the reason I started my other podcast, which is called Big Brave Business, I co host that with my friend Amanda, and it's literally exactly what it sounds like. 

[00:15:59] It's primarily for service provider entrepreneurs, but it any entrepreneurial business owner, I think, it's Could potentially love it if you love us. 

[00:16:07] But we we want to have those big, brave conversations about what it's really like to run a business.

[00:16:11] And part of the reason why it was important to me to start it is because I listen not only to my clients in strategy sessions, et cetera. 

[00:16:18] And I like know that their brain behind what they're trying to accomplish, but I also listened to all of their raw audio because we're editing. 

[00:16:24] So I know them.

[00:16:25] How well do they know me? So I feel so close to them, but in order for them to feel like the same level of connection and intimacy with me, I knew. 

[00:16:34] They needed a podcast from me and not just a podcast about podcasting. They already get that in strategy sessions, monthly trainings, all of the resources, weekly emails, whatever. 

[00:16:43] They needed to hear the me.

[00:16:45] And so that is a way a bunch of my, not everybody, of course, no pressure, but a lot of my clients listen to my podcast. 

[00:16:51] And it's a way that they know what's going on with me. 

[00:16:53] They know how I work. They know my core values. Yeah, exactly. Like you said, it's just building a deeper level of trust and intimacy with that person. 

[00:17:01] That now is mutual because we can listen to each other's audio. 

[00:17:05] Yeah, that's great. 

[00:17:06] And when we first started the podcast, it was never my intention to use it to build a business. 

[00:17:11] I just wanted to share ideas or whatever. But now I do get clients from the podcast. 

[00:17:16] Either for our small group. Or for one on one services. And power hours or whatever.

[00:17:21] So it's crazy how it works, but it is such a just such an amazing tool to build relationships. 

[00:17:28] And I'm one of those people. I don't have to know you to give you a hug. I am just like, what, I have no personal space. 

[00:17:33] I have no boundaries anywhere in my life. It really works for me too because there's somebody like, Hey, Crystal.

[00:17:39] I'm like, Hey, new friend! 

[00:17:40] Oh, I feel that from you, by the way, I feel that warmth from you. 

[00:17:42] Not the no boundaries thing. I can't comment on that. 

[00:17:44] But I feel that if I was with you in person, I feel that you are warm and friendly and would have led with a hug. 

[00:17:50] Oh, thanks. That's pretty accurate.

[00:17:52] Yeah, thank you. Thank you for saying that. That's so fun. Okay, so we've talked a little bit about, like, why audio content is so valuable. Just pretty much everything we were just talking about. 

[00:18:01] Was there anything else that you would say that audio adds? In terms of value that other things don't? 

[00:18:07] I just want to capitalize we said this but I want to capitalize it really clearly for you which is your reason for starting the podcast does not have to be or for having a podcast if you already have one does not have to be to get clients. 

[00:18:18] It can be to build relationships that's with people who are guesting that's with people who are listening. 

[00:18:22] And then over time, as you've built something, and as you've stepped more into building your expertise by having these conversations, you can leverage it with a bunch of new opportunities.

[00:18:30] You've got this community of people who really wants more and more from you. And you enjoy. And you have a really strong connection with, and it organically can happen that you come up with ways to leverage that. 

[00:18:40] So I think there's this misconception of the only way to see ROI from your podcast is if you're getting new clients. And instead of thinking of it in those terms that this is pressure because it has to be a funnel, which is going to come across in your content. 

[00:18:50] Instead, think of it as the point of this is to share ideas, is to build a community, is to connect with other people. 

[00:18:56] Is to make somebody feel less alone. And then when those relationships are already there, then what, how you can continue to help each other and how you can continue to add value and come up with new creative ways to connect with that community that happens naturally.

[00:19:08] In 

Expanding Your Reach with Facebook Groups and Private Podcasts

[00:19:09] terms of creating community, you mentioned that you had a Facebook group for your podcast. 

[00:19:13] And I don't have a Facebook group for my podcast, but I was nervous about having that because I wasn't, I didn't want to have to police it and manage it. 

[00:19:21] How is that going for you?

[00:19:22] Do you have any ideas for that? for someone, if they wanted to start a Facebook group for their podcast, what should we do? 

[00:19:27] 100%. Okay, so here's another permission slip. And we said this at the beginning, so this might be a good opportunity to slide some of that in. But here's your permission slip to do the best you can with what you have, right?

[00:19:36] So I started a Facebook Primarily be honestly, the first way that I was connecting with listeners on that show. I started that show back in 2018. 

[00:19:43] So it's 2024 when we're recording this now. 

[00:19:45] So I've literally been doing this for five and a half years. It hasn't been perfect, but it's mostly been weekly for five and a half years.

[00:19:51] That's a long time to podcast. And over time, as I was doing this, I was like, you need to be able to connect with listeners. So I created a really simple email address at gmail. com. 

[00:20:00] That people could use to send me emails. But I knew that I needed to be capturing their emails so that I could have an email list.

[00:20:06] I wasn't ready to run one. I wasn't ready to start. Send them weekly content. But I was like, I need to be able to collect emails. So I was like, how am I going to, everybody says have a lead magnet, this and that, but you know what, this is not an established business or anything. It's a hobby, right?

[00:20:20] Like I'm just doing this podcast as extra. So the Facebook group, honestly, originally for me was just a way to be able to say, do you want to opt into receiving emails from us? If so, put your email address as an entry. question. 

[00:20:32] So at first I was literally just putting people into a Facebook group and doing nothing with it.

[00:20:38] It was just a way for me to get people's emails. And then it became a place where people could ask questions. 

[00:20:44] I would put engagement questions in there. So I would just pop a question in there and I'd schedule these out, right? So I'd come up with seven and then schedule them out for a couple of weeks where I'd say like, how long have you been volunteering with Girl Scouts?

[00:20:55] And that's it. And then everybody wants to comment and answer that question. 

[00:20:58] So you get a lot of engagement on that post. Great. I did not have the bandwidth to do any kind of adminning. I did not promote it at all. I am not consistent with posting in there still. 

[00:21:08] But now at this point, we have I think, 800 people in that group, obviously very niche group.

[00:21:12] So it's not like, there are troop leader Facebook groups that have tens of thousands of people, but that it's fine. 800 people is great. I would say around the 550 mark is where I started seeing like they start engaging with each other, but it's cool because someone will comment a question that's intended for me because they feel like they know me, right?

[00:21:29] Sarah, I have this question. I need your help. And my community will respond before I even see it. 

[00:21:34] And they will say, Check out episode 114 and episode 155. She covers this. 

[00:21:38] Blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, I don't even remember talking about that on the podcast. My community knows my show exactly. 

[00:21:45] They're linking stuff for me and they're answering on my behalf.

[00:21:49] So it actually is really amazing. I would say probably it can easily get out of control if you have tens of thousands of people who are joining. 

[00:21:56] But for now, that works pretty well for me. Do what you can. 

[00:21:59] We have a private Facebook group for the members of the SEO squad, which is like my founding members group for SEO.

[00:22:06] And I always upload the video because I'm still trying to work out like how I'm going to put it in Searchie.io. 

[00:22:11] But I'm trying to figure out, do I want to put it in Searchie.io or, how do I want to give this to them and make it easy? Because it's like on Facebook, it's easy, on, on searchy, it's, I can do an audio, I can do the audio format.

[00:22:24] And so I put the video and the audio in Google drive. But I know there's a better way. And so I'm thinking about doing like a private podcast feed, just like I do this one. 

[00:22:33] Do you have any recommendations for something like that? 

[00:22:36] Yeah. 

[00:22:37] I think that it's worth saying there's a lot of other versions of leveraging audio only content that don't have to look like traditional podcasting. 

[00:22:43] And a private podcast is a great way to do it. That's becoming more and more popular. I think as people get used to private podcasts, they're easier.

[00:22:52] There is a certain level of explanation of how to access the feed. And how that works. And making sure you're helping people like holding their hand to access the show a little bit. 

[00:23:02] So that I think is still maybe a little bit rough around the edges. But I think But if you have screenshots and you give a little guide. 

[00:23:09] Then you can, depending on your audience, how technical they are, then that helps. I think that private podcasts can be a great way to, again, to maintain that kind of connection with your audience. 

[00:23:20] But Depending on the content, I would also question like, does it have to be private? 

[00:23:25] But yes, private podcasting is definitely an option and it can be an ongoing private podcast.

[00:23:28] It can be a limited series podcast. I have a private podcast for my clients. That's only for my clients that has replays of our monthly trainings and our Q and a sessions. 

[00:23:38] So I do that. I would tell you that the. I think it's important to have that information available to them where they're most likely to consume it.

[00:23:45] So having it in all the ways is great. But I definitely get more, I guess, traffic live than I do on the private podcast, but it's also a very small pool of people that I am with my private podcast. Yeah. 

[00:23:58] Yeah. And that's the thing I'm thinking too about managing the group as it gets bigger, because I want everyone to feel, to feel very cared about. 

[00:24:06] And that I'm paying attention to them and what they need.

[00:24:08] So I am really loving the audio idea for this. 

[00:24:12] Because like I said I upload the video in the audio, but that podcast just in your ear, that's like you said, it's such an intimate thing. 

[00:24:19] And I think that is probably going to be something that we do in the future. 

[00:24:23] And it's they're on the go too. 

[00:24:24] So it's allowing them to be able to take care of the things they need to take care of and to go the places that they need to go. 

[00:24:30] And you can still go with them.

[00:24:31] So especially with retention for a membership, I think it can be helpful just because Counting on them to make the dedicated time. That's like the number one reason people are going to leave. It's either money or time. I don't have the time for this. 

[00:24:41] This has a lot of value, but only if I spend time on it.

[00:24:44] So if you make it something they can consume while they're on the go, then that helps. 

[00:24:47] Yes, exactly. And that's the problem with YouTube is that you can't watch YouTube and drive.

[00:24:53] Okay. 

Exploring Non-Traditional Podcasting Formats

[00:24:53] So is there any other forms of non traditional podcasting? Because I'm thinking like, this is the only podcasting I know.

[00:24:59] I just heard about private podcasting last year. 

[00:25:01] Is there anything else? 

[00:25:03] Yeah. So I would say some of the other things that I think are worth considering. 

[00:25:07] Are, of course you could do seasons instead of just like an ongoing weekly podcast so that I would consider that non traditional podcast.

[00:25:14] You could also have a serial podcast, which honestly. It has been, like, a very old form of podcasting, but it is, I would consider it non traditional as far as, or unconventional, maybe? When we think of a podcast, we tend to think of a weekly ongoing show, so just the idea of it is only a limited series and it exists in order.

[00:25:33] Okay, can you go back and explain the seasonal one? The season one means a couple of different things to me. 

[00:25:38] Oh yeah, sure. Okay. 

[00:25:39] So what I was referring to, but I'm curious what else came to mind, what I was referring to for seasonal is you do weekly podcasts or whatever frequency for.

[00:25:49] A certain number of weeks or a certain number of episodes. And then you take a break and then you come back for another season on a designated date. 

[00:25:56] So the podcast that I host, Big Brave Business, we took a break between season one and season two, and we played replays. So it's not like our feed was empty, but it was just like a.

[00:26:07] Six week break, I think? Five week break in between. And it just gave us time to re strategize, to regroup, to take some time off of recording, and to plan what do we want our intentional content to be for season two. So that was really helpful for us just from the standpoint of I don't want to just show up each week and be like, okay, I have to come up with something to talk about.

[00:26:25] I want to be intentional about what my content plan is. 

[00:26:28] So how did you present those six weeks when you were off? Did you do like a special intro or did you just let it ride? 

[00:26:35] So we did a thanks for season one kind of episode. Where we talked about in general things that are growing and changing and evolving and stretching in our individual businesses. 

[00:26:45] And how things have, it's really causing us to overturn all the stones. 

[00:26:49] And look at how we're doing things and question could I be doing this better?

[00:26:51] And we used that as not just the topic for the episode, but then we were able to use that theme to say one of the things we're looking at we are revising the strategy of and seeing how could we do this better and how could we do this even more effectively as with the podcast. So we're going to take a few weeks to reassess.

[00:27:07] How we want to approach season two. And we will back be back on this specific date. That's when the first episode of season two is going to air. And in the meantime, this feed will not be empty. So keep coming back each week because our best advice is from this season one is going to be in the feed for the next what, however many weeks it was.

[00:27:25] So that was the way that we handled it. I think. 

[00:27:28] We also mentioned if you have, if you're new to the show, or if you haven't heard all of our back catalog before, then there's going to be episodes. You may not have heard. And we're really proud of the work that we're putting here.

[00:27:37] And then also if you have listened to it, these are episodes you probably haven't heard in a while. It may be good to hear it again with a new, fresh perspective of where you are today. 

[00:27:45] So please still continue to show up with us each week. 

[00:27:48] And that's how we chose to approach it. But I think as long as you set really clear expectations that you will be back and when you'll be back. That is like my biggest tip for seasonal podcasts. Because otherwise people just feel abandoned and ghosted.

[00:28:00] And that happens so often where somebody just Stops podcasting with no warning and people will just unsubscribe and be like, Oh, I guess I just that shows done now. 

[00:28:09] Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:28:09] For sure. Okay. So there's seasonal and then there's the serial and then ...

[00:28:13] so I would say there's also using a private podcast- or it doesn't even have to be private.

[00:28:17] It could be public. But a really short, like. Three to five episode funnel. So it could just be this just exists for the purpose of pushing people to a specific offer or to a specific something. For example, I mentioned I offer a 90 minute strategy session for that like signature strategy. I talked about either earlier with the three parts for launching, we're actually working on recording that into just a five short episode Mini series that will be a private podcast.

[00:28:44] You sign up with your email address, right? 

[00:28:46] Like a lead magnet. And then it's going to send this to you and we're actually going to do that instead of doing those, strategy sessions for free live so you can pay for it to have it one on one live like we have been doing Or the free version, you'll take yourself through it, self paced, right?

[00:29:00] And then it's ultimately promoting our launch services. So at the end, you've gone through this, you've self paced through this, et cetera. 

[00:29:07] And that's pushing a bunch of people onto your email list. So who, are already excited about what you want to do. 

[00:29:12] But maybe, are shy or don't trust sales calls or whatever their mindset issues are that prevent them from actually scheduling the call with you.

[00:29:20] Yeah, that's cool. That's really funny. 

[00:29:22] One idea I had for my business Collage and Wood: because I deal with senior night and mothers of seniors in high school. 

[00:29:29] And I know that this is a really tough, like emotional time. And I've been trying to do this for two years.

[00:29:34] I've only got one interview so far with a mom. 

[00:29:36] But I do have another interview with a sports, like psychology coach or something like that. But I want to be able to offer something to the moms to listen to. 

[00:29:45] So they know all the feelings that they're having are normal. And Yeah. 

[00:29:49] And that just ideas for what other people did on their senior nights. Because a lot of times these things are just thrown on people.

[00:29:55] And, in my generation, 20 years ago, we did not have senior nights. 

[00:29:59] I don't remember a big celebration for me as a senior. 

[00:30:02] But now it's a big deal, really, go all out. Yeah. 

[00:30:05] So that's something that I wanted to add and it's just now getting, just two or three other people to contribute.

[00:30:10] So I can make it a little series. 

[00:30:12] Yeah, I love that. And another one other version of non traditional podcasting, which kind of fits into that. As a sort of spin on it is to do an audio summit. So these are becoming more and more popular again. I think people are craving those on both sides.

[00:30:27] People who held online conferences became such a rage during the quarantine era. 

[00:30:32] But now everybody wants to be back together in person, and that's a lot harder and more expensive to put together as a business owner. 

[00:30:38] An audio summit is like a compromise because it's something that can be consumed on the go.

[00:30:41] It can be live, but it doesn't have to be live. It can totally be pre recorded. 

[00:30:45] And it's an opportunity as well to collaborate with a bunch of people who you genuinely just want to collaborate with. 

[00:30:51] Great followup. If you do have a standard podcast or if you have been a guest on podcasts to then have something to invite people back, right?

[00:30:57] Like you invited me for dinner at your house. Now I'm inviting you for dinner at mine.

[00:31:01] It's just a handful of episodes. So maybe 10 to 12 total episodes. 

[00:31:04] Maybe even eight, right? You're going to pick handpick people who you want to bring in to have conversations.

[00:31:09] You can record them as interviews or have them prerecord their sessions. You put them together in whatever order makes the most sense for you and your audience. 

[00:31:15] And then everybody who participated in that audio summit promotes it to their own list and you get to use it as a list builder.

[00:31:22] So whatever opt in situation that you have and choose that is legal. That allows people to choose who they want to opt into on that list of collaborators, you do you, I'm not a lawyer. 

[00:31:31] Yeah, it is a great list builder for you as the host. And so it's actually surprisingly easy to host one. I just did one in three weeks. 

[00:31:39] And that's actually the first time you and I had a chance to collaborate together. 

[00:31:43] Is I asked you to come on because I had listened to your show and I knew you would have great advice for our audience about just the changing landscape of business and how SEO can really support you as a podcaster and a business owner.

[00:31:54] So yeah, so we just did that. 

[00:31:56] And I think you shared your session on here too, right? 

[00:31:59] I did. Yeah. One of my follow up Fridays. 

[00:32:02] Yeah. So that session was part of our audio summit. That was just one of eight guests that I brought in. And it was just so fun. It was such a great group of people.

[00:32:11] I loved the content and now it's built these relationships even stronger for me of people that I collaborated with. So it was surprisingly easy to do. 

[00:32:19] And no regrets, man. So I highly recommend an audio summit. I think that is a great list builder. 

[00:32:24] I got some sales calls scheduled from it. 

[00:32:26] But more than that, I built relationships with these people who I genuinely want to continue to collaborate with.

[00:32:31] Yeah. And I think that's very cool because when someone asks me now about, who would you recommend? And I already did. I sent someone your way.

[00:32:38] But yeah, because we collaborated. I told you I loved working with your team. They were so kind. They're so patient. So I can definitely vouch for that now.

[00:32:47] There was one question that we didn't get to that. I wanted to ask so so badly.

Maximizing Guest Appearances on Podcasts for SEO and Networking

[00:32:50] Top tips for guesting on other people's podcasts. 

[00:32:54] Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So identify shows that have an audience that matches who you are trying to serve, right?

[00:33:02] So you need to know who the actual audience is. 

[00:33:04] That sounds like a dumb tip, but honestly, the number of blind pitches that go out is just sick. 

[00:33:08] You need to make sure the show is current. It has episodes that are still being posted because lots of shows are not currently active.

[00:33:14] You should actually listen to it and make sure you like the way that the information is delivered and that you like what the host has to say and that you're on the same page. 

[00:33:21] I like to say it has to be a core value match. So make sure that it's a core value match. After you've listened to their show and you like it, leave them a review.

[00:33:29] That goes such a long way. Podcasters read all of their reviews, guarantee. I guarantee they read it. So you definitely want to leave them a review. They'll probably remember that name if your name shows up on your review. And then make it a relationship that you're trying to build. And then Also, this is very important related to that.

[00:33:46] If they have a, an established method of how to apply to be a guest, follow that. 

[00:33:51] So look for that first. And if they have an established method, follow that first. 

[00:33:56] And don't, you don't have to pay to be on podcasts. There are podcasts that require fees.

[00:34:00] My honest tip is to avoid them.

[00:34:02] There's enough people out there who are creating really great content that you do not need to pay to be on their show. 

[00:34:07] And then just always taking it from an angle of a, it's a core value match and B, this is a genuine relationship I want to build and not just asking permission to come and sell them something.

[00:34:16] It's really obnoxious. So be a good house guest. 

[00:34:19] Last thing I want to say about that too, is the real benefit on the SEO side is that you get a backlink, from the show. 

[00:34:26] And from whatever podcast player that they use. Like I use Buzzsprout. 

[00:34:31] So, Buzzsprout has a, domain authority in the eighties or seventies or something like that.

[00:34:36] That's a great backlink from the SEO perspective, it's a n o brainer to go on pod. 

[00:34:41] Yeah. And you're finding people who already like listening to podcasts. So if you have a show to promote, then it's definitely the best strategy for growing your own podcast as well. 

[00:34:50] Because you're reaching a dedicated audience of podcast listeners. 

[00:34:54] So I would say that as well. I do have a whole training that we did on this, that is available on our site, just podfoxmedia. com and it has the video training that we did on it, as well as a complete comprehensive companion guide. That will walk you through how to identify shows.

[00:35:10] There's even a swipe pitch yourself file in there. 

[00:35:13] So you can swipe that file and just fill it in the template to pitch yourself. So I do have that at podfoxmedia. com. 

[00:35:19] Awesome. 

How to Collaborate with PodFox Media

[00:35:19] That's such a great segue into how can people work with you and get in touch with you?

[00:35:24] Yeah. So like I mentioned, there's three main ways that you can Get help from PodFox.

[00:35:29] One is that full service production. So if you want to launch a traditional or nontraditional podcast we can help you with the full service production side. 

[00:35:36] Also, if you have a podcast or if you're going to DIY it, or you have been DIYing it, you can just do a strategy session. 

[00:35:42] And if you don't really want to commit to anything that big, but you do want the ongoing trainings and resources.

[00:35:48] Then you can join the audio revolution. So the three kind of links, they're easy are to learn about our full service podcast production and to get that 90 minute strategy session, you want to go to launch my show. com. 

[00:36:00] The best way to schedule just a consulting session is to go to help my show. com. 

[00:36:08] And then the best way to either sign up for the audio revolution or to join our waitlist if the doors are not currently open is audio revolution. co. 

[00:36:17] Awesome. We'll put those links in the show notes for you so that you can, go directly to Sarah and her team over at Podfox Media.

[00:36:24] It was so great being a part of your summit! 

[00:36:26] And thank you so much for coming on the show. And listening to the show. And just being such a great person to network with. 

[00:36:32] Yeah, thank you for having me, and I can't wait to see what else we will come up with for ways to collaborate from here.

[00:36:37] Yeah, I see some opportunities in our future. 

[00:36:39] It's gonna be good. 

[00:36:40] Alright, bye guys! 

[00:36:41] ​